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Post by jabberwocky on May 23, 2016 20:32:42 GMT -5
Below is a copy and paste from an email I received from the gringo real estate agency in Medellin, I know its from a realtor and they have reason to pimp Cali - but just wondered what others thought - anyone here from Cali and can offer an opinion?
Only been to Cali once - my opinion - a little poorer, maybe a little less secure, surrounding countryside not as pretty as around Medellin, friendly people, lots of silicone!
Cali? Why Cali?
We asked ourselves the same thing November 2015 when it was first proposed to us.
Yes, we knew it was the salsa capital of the world.
Yes, we knew it was a primary commercial hub for import/export trade in Colombia.
Yes, we knew it was a 90 minute drive to the Pacific Ocean.
Yes, we also knew that it had a lingering crime reputation left over from the bad drug days in Colombia.
What we didn't know is more than 50 international conglomerates have a physical presence there. Colgate Palmolive, Johnson & Johnson, and many others.
We also didn't know that Hilton, Marriott, Small Luxury Hotels had all staked a claim there during the past 24 months.
It surprised us too that the international airport was undergoing an 18 million dollar expansion. That's doubling the size to accommodate its current 72 weekly international flights.
Hmmm.... what's up? It begged us profit-seekers for further investigation.
As it turns out, Cali is much more than salsa and smoke. It's becoming a destination as Colombia's third largest city.
Culture is abundant, skies are fresh and clear, traffic is easy to negotiate, sports, health and intelligence is an underlying theme, the leafy river-walk is safe and pleasant, the food is upscale and the nightlife is increasingly sophisticated.
Before investing in what appeared to be undervalued properties, we needed confirmation of demand for Cali, so we put the question out to our deep database of worldwide travelers and investors for real answers, and guess what? A full 27% of our travelers have Cali on their list.
Problem is, there are only two choices for travelers and business people in Cali.
Hotels of decent quality and location range from $80 and up, or hostels that cater to budgets of less than $40, mostly much less, sometimes in sketchy neighborhoods.
This is style of luxury suite we are looking to create.
Aha! That's the dynamic that makes for opportunity!
Fill the gap. Serve a demand by offering quality, value and experience. That's our specialty!
So after months of digging deep we've purchased two well positioned properties that will offer superior returns to those able to see uncut gems.
The neighborhoods of Granada, El Peñon and several others remind us of Medellin's El Poblado ten years ago. So that's where our focus belongs.
We're about to begin renovations on two prime properties and we're now able to offer you an opportunity on the first development in the neighborhood of El Peñon.
If you have even an inkling of interest, send me an email at rich@farmedellin.com so I can send you the Villa del Peñon Investors Kit.
We're excited about opportunities in Cali and would enjoy answering your questions.
~ Yours for good investing!
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Post by scumbuster on May 23, 2016 21:00:15 GMT -5
Sounds like an International Living add. LOL If you would like to sign up as a roving reporter for this site you can check it out and update us. We can offer you a neat title and some stars after your name. Something like "Investigative Journalist" With 4 blue stars after it. We could even give you a staff if someone else wants to get a fancy title and stars too. Maybe "Apprentice Investigative Journalist" With 3 blue stars. Since we can give 5 stars there is room for a promotion.
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Post by billyb on May 23, 2016 21:01:45 GMT -5
What about a salary?
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Post by jabberwocky on May 23, 2016 21:05:04 GMT -5
If you ignore the BS - thoughts on Cali - poised to become a tourist destination? - I don't see it but then my experience there is limited.
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Post by scumbuster on May 23, 2016 21:08:10 GMT -5
I wouldn't be interested in Cali. I flew into Cali once early last year on my way to Popayan. Didn't see much other than passing through on the bus to Popayan. Seemed pretty dingy and hot, hot, hot... The airport needed lots of work.. It too seemed pretty dingy.
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Post by scumbuster on May 23, 2016 21:11:06 GMT -5
I think wildstubby has spent some time in Cali. He may be able to enlighten us a little.
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Post by fishhead on May 23, 2016 23:13:28 GMT -5
Cali is hot, no doubt about it. I'm living here because of my wife (and as a secondary reason, because it's cheap)- for any other reason I would not want to live here.
Sure, it's got some halfway decent corners - the above mentioned Granada and El Penon or Ciudad Jardin in the south - but in general, it's a pretty bleak city. The crime rate is still pretty high, but that's mostly due to a couple of barrios that no Gringo should go to anyway.
On the plus side, if you believe in Colombia's future, it's got huge potential and real estate is still a lot cheaper than in Bogota or Medellin. The potential for development includes things like restaurants, the cultural scene etc. There has been a lot of movement in the last 10 years, but again, it's still noticeably behind BOG and MED. If you want to invest for the long term, Cali could be a really good place to go, but of course the risks are also there. It's Colombia.
There is lots of builing going on - the airport is getting a major overhaul and extension, the Pacific highway is shortly going to be 2 lanes all the way, there are lots of new malls coming online, but the original center of the city is still pretty crappy.
Now, if I were a (single) 20something, I would see the place with very different eyes. If you want to, you can basically party non-stop and the girls are really pretty. Ethnically, it's more colorful than BOG or MED (which is a plus for parties and girls, imho). If that's your thing, Cali can be paradise, but I'm not that age anymore and I get really grumpy these days if I have to stay out longer than 10PM...
As far as that original e-mail, goes, I don't think there are any major lies in there, but it's all being put in the best possible light. One thing that struck me funny are the '90 minutes to the Pacific Ocean'. If you put a Colombian bus driver in a Porsche, that could be true (provided he survives the trip), but for us mere mortals, it's more like 3 hours. And even if you get there, you arrive in Buenaventura - sure there's the ocean and a port, but apart from that, it's more of a hellhole.
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2016 23:43:09 GMT -5
As far as that original e-mail, goes, I don't think there are any major lies in there, but it's all being put in the best possible light. One thing that struck me funny are the '90 minutes to the Pacific Ocean'. If you put a Colombian bus driver in a Porsche, that could be true (provided he survives the trip), but for us mere mortals, it's more like 3 hours. And even if you get there, you arrive in Buenaventura - sure there's the ocean and a port, but apart from that, it's more of a hellhole. I can't see the proximity with Buenaventura like an advantage either, unless you're a drug exporter. Buenaventura is a dangerous place to go, and has no special grace. Maybe for an unsuspecting foreigner, "Pacific Ocean" may sound attractive, but for anyone who knows just a bit of Colombia, it is definitely not a strong point.
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Post by billyb on May 24, 2016 0:49:15 GMT -5
Cali is hot, no doubt about it. I'm living here because of my wife (and as a secondary reason, because it's cheap)- for any other reason I would not want to live here. Sure, it's got some halfway decent corners - the above mentioned Granada and El Penon or Ciudad Jardin in the south - but in general, it's a pretty bleak city. The crime rate is still pretty high, but that's mostly due to a couple of barrios that no Gringo should go to anyway. On the plus side, if you believe in Colombia's future, it's got huge potential and real estate is still a lot cheaper than in Bogota or Medellin. The potential for development includes things like restaurants, the cultural scene etc. There has been a lot of movement in the last 10 years, but again, it's still noticeably behind BOG and MED. If you want to invest for the long term, Cali could be a really good place to go, but of course the risks are also There is lots of builing going on - the airport is getting a major overhaul and extension, the Pacific highway is shortly going to be 2 lanes all the way, there are lots of new malls coming online, but the original center of the city is still pretty crappy. Now, if I were a (single) 20something, I would see the place with very different eyes. If you want to, you can basically party non-stop and the girls are really pretty. Ethnically, it's more colorful than BOG or MED (which is a plus for parties and girls, imho). If that's your thing, Cali can be paradise, but I'm not that age anymore and I get really grumpy these days if I have to stay out longer than 10PM... As far as that original e-mail, goes, I don't think there are any major lies in there, but it's all being put in the best possible light. One thing that struck me funny are the '90 minutes to the Pacific Ocean'. If you put a Colombian bus driver in a Porsche, that could be true (provided he survives the trip), but for us mere mortals, it's more like 3 hours. And even if you get there, you arrive in Buenaventura - sure there's the ocean and a port, but apart from that, it's more of a hellhole. Fish pretty much hit the nail on the head as far as RE prices. I would add that there are some very nice neighborhoods in the West/North West, such as Sta. Rita, Sta. Teresita, Arboleda, Normandia, Juananbu and Sta. Monica Alta. 90 minutes to B'tura is a dream like fish points out, but the proximity of its port would be an asset to any business either importing or exporting. Like fish also mentioned, crime stats also need to be scraped, as 90% is between street gangs fighting for micro trafficing territory, so if you are a gringo that keeps his nose out of the business, and doesn't act like an ahole in public, drunk or otherwise, it will not be that much more dangerous than any other large city. Try being a show off drunk in Oakland Calif and see how long you last. So macro economics aside, Cali is a way cheaper proposition than Meds, Ctd, or Bog. I would also look at Pereirafor growth if that is what you are looking for. A few years back, Pererira, Manizales and Armenia camo to a sort of an informal convention, where they would try to stop triplicating resources in the Eje, and direct them where they are more appropriate. So Manizales specializes in Education, Armenia tourism, and Pereira commerce. And Pereira is powering ahead of its fellow triplets as far economic dinamics are concerned.
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Post by billyb on May 24, 2016 1:00:44 GMT -5
BTW, Granada night life is dead. Ever since they closed most of its streets for resurfacing and put the stub poles to prevent sidewalk parking, it never recovered. The restaurant epicenter is now in El Penon and the river banks in the west. With some around Parque del Perro. San Antonio, the oldest part of Cali, is seeing a nightlife and restaurant revival, and people restoring the ancient houses like the Candelaria in Bogota (but the boat already sailed in San Antonio as far as reasonable prices are concerned), but in a much smaller scale. Night life is now out by Menga on the way to Jumbo, and after hours salsa in Juanchito. Some low life type night life in la Sexta closer to the river (where you find the newbie gringo tourists looking for a hook up, and getting worked), getting much better the farther north you go (locals). Also great escapes from the hot weather in the Carretera al Mar, such as K18, El Carmen, K30, or to Dapa or La Cumbre further north. All are 30 minutes to an hour, and about 30 degrees cooler, away.
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Post by jabberwocky on May 24, 2016 5:41:16 GMT -5
IS there a decent beach town that can be reached easily from Cali - I know BV is a pit, but any small towns somewhat close by that are more touristy? I have never heard of one. I don;t know one friend or family member who has ever been to a Pacific beach, a couple have been to BV - but it was work related.
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Post by ozgringo on May 24, 2016 6:44:20 GMT -5
90 minutes to the coast rings alarm bells. IMO
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Post by bickmed on May 24, 2016 7:23:38 GMT -5
That's a First American Realty add, who have teamed up with the Cali Adventurer blogger to open a franchise there. Been to Cali a few times, and while it is great for nightlife and has friendly people, it has nothing on the city of Medellin or Bogota IMO.
Cali seems to be attracting more attention from the backpacker crowd at least though, and I guess expats will follow.
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Post by billyb on May 24, 2016 8:49:11 GMT -5
IS there a decent beach town that can be reached easily from Cali - I know BV is a pit, but any small towns somewhat close by that are more touristy? I have never heard of one. I don;t know one friend or family member who has ever been to a Pacific beach, a couple have been to BV - but it was work related. None that are to my taste. Too risky if you go up Choco way.
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Post by dandl93 on May 24, 2016 8:57:43 GMT -5
billyb Are you still in touch with your old fling (FJ) in Cali, I am sure she would give out some great info on Cali especially if you would sweet talk her.... jajajajajajaajj
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Post by billyb on May 24, 2016 9:13:55 GMT -5
Haven't talked to her in a long time, but last time she sent you her love, said you were her one and only, jajajaja
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Post by elexpatriado on May 24, 2016 9:17:47 GMT -5
Cali sucks. Punto cerrado.
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Post by jabberwocky on May 24, 2016 9:46:10 GMT -5
The email stated - $80 and up for good lodging in Cali , out of curiosity I checked Hilton's website - for the Hampton Inn, which I believe is newer with the exchange rate at 3,000 pesos - it is $60/night. While the Hampton is not a luxury brand - it is a part of the Hilton chain, and my second home in South Florida.
So his economics may not be spot on. I can't believe Cali will ever be a big travel destination for gringos - first not enough direct flights, Cartagena, Bogota, Medellin and possibly Santa Marta - I can see them standing out but Cali - not so sure. One thing I would worry about in a second tier city - what happens if the FARC or some Narco group blows up one bus killing a tourist or two ( a gringo or Canuk) it would be big news and would quickly kill tourism - Cali already has an iffy reputation - would not take much to get people to bypass it.
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Post by billyb on May 24, 2016 10:25:45 GMT -5
It's pretty much baked in reputation wise, one dead gringo is not going to change things much. And I can't recall a gringo killed in Cali. Cali attracts an edgier clientele than Meds. Many gringos that inhabit Parque Lleras are probably scared of Cali's rrp, but in real life, they are about the same. Like I mentioned before, most of Cali's, and Pereira's crime stats are due to gangs fighting for micro territory. And if foreigners stay away from that, they will stay away from the overwhelming risk. Then again, that rep might not be a bad thing, if it keeps a lot of thecriff raff from visiting and in Medellin where it belongs.
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Post by jabberwocky on May 24, 2016 11:16:51 GMT -5
billyb - agree - mostly perception not reality - but what type of tourists is Cali trying to attract? At this point can't see a lot of gringo retirees heading there to check it out. The ad touted the increase in tourists - and the chance for more - just wondering what type, monger types might go but that is a very small percentage of the tourist trade ( at least I hope so) I attended an IT security conference there about 5 years ago - it seems to have a big IT community - maybe there is growth in the business side of the city that will attract more business related travel.
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Post by billyb on May 24, 2016 11:58:30 GMT -5
billyb - agree - mostly perception not reality - but what type of tourists is Cali trying to attract? At this point can't see a lot of gringo retirees heading there to check it out. The ad touted the increase in tourists - and the chance for more - just wondering what type, monger types might go but that is a very small percentage of the tourist trade ( at least I hope so) I attended an IT security conference there about 5 years ago - it seems to have a big IT community - maybe there is growth in the business side of the city that will attract more business related travel.
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Post by livinginmedellin on May 24, 2016 12:13:27 GMT -5
It's pretty much baked in reputation wise, one dead gringo is not going to change things much. And I can't recall a gringo killed in Cali. Cali attracts an edgier clientele than Meds. Many gringos that inhabit Parque Lleras are probably scared of Cali's rrp, but in real life, they are about the same. Like I mentioned before, most of Cali's, and Pereira's crime stats are due to gangs fighting for micro territory. And if foreigners stay away from that, they will stay away from the overwhelming risk. Then again, that rep might not be a bad thing, if it keeps a lot of thecriff raff from visiting and in Medellin where it belongs. There have been some gringos killed in Cali that I remember from the defunct gringos.com site that is unfortunately gone. Here's one that is dated, in 2007 an American who ran a matchmaking site www.latinwomenconnection.com was killed by gunmen on a moto: www.nbcnews.com/id/17893261/ns/world_news-americas/t/matchmaking-american-killed-colombia/. And here's a foreigner from Europe killed in Cali last year - hsbnoticias.com/noticias/judicial/asesinado-extranjero-en-cali-cuando-se-hallaba-en-panaderia-133980 . I recall there were others. Cali is considered the most dangerous city in Colombia. IMHO it's unlikely that Cali will ever attract much of an expat community due to its reputation for crime and hotter climate. But Cali was still touted in Peddicord's Live & Invest Overseas last year - www.overseaspropertyalert.com/bargain-properties-great-lifestyle-and-a-low-cost-of-living/. Note that First American Realty Medellin (FARM) has a relationship with Live & Invest Overseas and FARM presents at the Live & Invest Overseas conference in Medellín each year and FARM runs the sheep around looking at expensive properties in El Poblado.
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Post by fishhead on May 24, 2016 12:19:36 GMT -5
IS there a decent beach town that can be reached easily from Cali - I know BV is a pit, but any small towns somewhat close by that are more touristy? I have never heard of one. I don;t know one friend or family member who has ever been to a Pacific beach, a couple have been to BV - but it was work related. You can take a lancha to Juanchaco and Ladrilleros, takes about an hour. It's very basic and simple there, but ok for a quick getaway. It's right across the bay from the big naval base Malaga, so I'd say it's secure. The beach is huge at low tide, almost nonexistent at high tide. There are cabanas for rent and also a handfull of small hotels with pools. It's been years though since I went there last time. In August and September you can do whale-watching there.
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Post by fishhead on May 24, 2016 12:24:00 GMT -5
Iirc, the last one was a Spaniard who was involved in the drug trade. (the link doesn't work). The most dangerous city in Colombia officially is Palmira, next to Cali.
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Post by fishhead on May 24, 2016 12:25:35 GMT -5
Cali sucks. Punto cerrado. Aww, come on. Some people pay real money for a good suck.
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Post by caliconnection on May 24, 2016 12:29:33 GMT -5
Not too much to add as there have already been good points made. Cali is a "working town" with not many touristy things to do. The water park is ok. Going up the hill to see the statue is ok (nice and cool up there). The kayaking around Cali in the countryside is very good. Too hot to mountain bike. Nighttime is great - you don't need a jacket - just need a t-shirt or short sleeved shirt, and some of the nightclubs are good. Lago Calima makes for a nice weekend visit.
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Post by gallito on May 24, 2016 12:34:03 GMT -5
Strategically Cali would be a good place to set up an export import business especially if you were exporting to the Pacific Rim;all the exports flow through Buenaventura Port.As for retiring in a city it would have advantages and disadvatages.Quality of life and medical would be big factors;don't know much about the city.
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Post by wendymor on May 24, 2016 14:54:49 GMT -5
Of course this is a First American Reality Medellin venture, does anyone know of the status of the "Global Express Business Center" project that has million of $$$ invested and was scheduled to open almost a year ago? I know the next great fast food concept "Empanada Express" failed with investor losses.
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Post by avispa on May 24, 2016 15:03:37 GMT -5
How's the golf in Cali? Any golfers here?
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Post by livinginmedellin on May 24, 2016 15:17:06 GMT -5
How's the golf in Cali? Any golfers here? Here's info on golf in Colombia - www.colombia.travel/en/meetings/golf - according to that there are three 18-hole courses in Cali plus two 9-hole courses.
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